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Does a slave have a soul? The books.. Intelligent slaves
Tavern Tattler and GS Homepage updates Caste Codes
Subtopic: More roleplay.. More Gorean

Does a slave have a soul?

Rollo the Ax~~~ Well... it looks to be past time to get this forum show on the road, so I may as well kick start it....LOL..I call this weeks GS forum to order.... same rules as always... anybody with a topic, give Me a whisper and well get going......

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~brushing hair back behind ears.. listening as He speaks.. reaching and giving galah's hand a quick squeeze.. she readies herself to scribe the forum notes~

Rollo the Ax~~~ Well, the first topic PMed to Me is from galah...so she can start off... go ahead girl...

galah{RA}~~~ this was somewhat discussed at the slave discussion but a girl would like to hear some opinions of the Free on this one, it seems there is no right or wrong answer but here goes....does a slave have a soul? if she has a soul, does she own her soul or does her Master own her soul?

Gornt~~~ soul? on Gor there is no afterlife, why would A/any need a soul?

shirin{SholGar}~~~ ~*~listens to galah, as having read over the notes from class, she begins pondering, curious to hear what the Free do think~*~

galah{RA}~~~ if a girl says her heart and soul belongs to her Master, then what happens when she is sold? does her soul automatically go to the new Master?

galah{RA}~~~ Master Gornt, galah speaks of the soul that makes each of us what we are, each of us different than another, that within that gives us life, not death

Emerald Forest~~~ *I think that a slave does have a soul,it what makes her the way she is and I would say that the Master or Mistress owns her soul while she is in Their kolar because They make her the way she is as well,the way she serves Them or the way she performs for Them*

Gornt~~~ hmmmmmmmm, that is a most interesting question
I don't think a slave has a soul

galah{RA}~~~ some believe that even the leaf on a tree has a soul...this makes it a most hard subject to ponder upon....many believe that even animals like bosk have souls? so even if a slave is thought to be no more than an animal, does she have a soul?

Gornt~~~ no because a slave has nothing of which is clearly theirs alone

inara{G}t~~~ *listens having already given her opinion before.*

Emerald Forest~~~ *everything and everybody has a soul otherwise they would not continue to live as their will would be gone*

Phen~~~ *Frowning as I try to get My brain around the question*...
Well galah I feel you have just answered the question yourself....as you say you girls are all different not in just being who you are but what you do...There are pleasure slaves, tavern slaves personal slaves...so what of the tavern slaves does their soul belong to all of the Captains?...Same of the girls who work in the mills who is their Master some don't even meet Him*SS*

Rollo the Ax~~~ the * soul * is matter for great debate.... just what IS a soul ????? is it an eternal life force that goes back to * heaven * when we die ?? is it a *being* that moves on to another body after each death, as in reincarnation ?? is it the electrical energy that our brains produce ????

galah{RA}~~~ does the soul fit into the catagory of a sense of humor, intelligence and such, for many slaves have those?

Emerald Forest~~~ *the soul is what makes everyone and everything different,if we didn't have a soul we would all be the same,we would walk and talk and hang the same as everyone and everything else*

inara{G}t~~~ *looks to Master Rollo at His last comment.*

Phen~~~ galah this is where I feel the problem lies we are philosophying over something that is "fantasy" being Gor from our own points of religous views...

galah{RA}~~~ a girl may well have a sense of humor for example, but if her Master don't like a girls' sense of humor, he surely will whip it right out of her....could the same be said about intelligence and the soul?

Gornt~~~ a soul could be crushed in a girl couldn't it?
~thinking out loud~

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~offering what she had responded already at slave discussions.. changing it a bit due to the use of first person speech.. *s*~

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~listening to galah's question.. ~
one believes so.. we have arms, legs, heart, toes, eyes.. etc.. so she feels we'd have a soul as well..
jasma{GS~FG}~~~ a Master wishes to own every part of a slave.. not just certain aspects.. not just the sexual side.. but every part.. so a slave's soul would belong to Him as well, just as her heart, mind, body, legs, arms, etc..
your personality.. is a part of you.. so if you're totally submitted.. that as well belongs to your Owner.. your spirit can be crushed by your Owner.. ~sighing~.. so.. yes.. even your sense of humor would belong to He/She that owns you..

Rollo the Ax~~~ LOL..LOL.. Gornt, some Eastern religions beleive that even plants, bugs and yes even rocks can have * souls *... so how could a slave NOT have one ??? do YOU have a soul ???? and if so, why not a female slave ??? she is still a human being... just her social status has changed.... what happens ??? put on a collar, and their * soul * flys out of their body ???? LOL..LOL.. I think NOT ......

Emerald Forest~~~ *I think the only way someone can whip the soul out of a slave is to kill her or him*

galah{RA}~~~ yes Mistress Phen, that is why galah said there is no right or wrong answer to this....but ones personal view could well determine how a Master or Mistress deals with slaves?

Gornt~~~ I have a conscience Captain, is that a soul?

Gornt~~~ but i will grant that a slave has soul, it owned however along with the rest of her by her Master

sorcha{HoS}~~~ tis a rather large philosphical debate.....for this one, the soul moves from lifetime to lifetime....her ego changes, but her soul remains true, growing with ones life experiences, ones ego can be crushed and moulded but one's soul cannot..but then this is only sorcha's view..*ss*...each to their own as long as it does not harm another...

now to the books, there was cases in the books where a Master would sell a slave cause he loved her too much and he thought that showed weakness, and of course, she loved him to with all her soul....when sold to one she don't know and her heart is broken, does that soul stay with the Master she loved or travel with her to the new Master she don't even know?

Phen~~~ *smiling* galah now that is also area of no right or wrong once one is owned whatever the girls owner desires is what They get if not the girl knows the consequences but I will also add this it is very rare to find cruelty in a Gorean Master...

Cernus~~~ thinking ..heavy subject matter ..

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ from dictionary.com

soul Pronunciation Key (sl)
The animating and vital principle in humans, credited with the faculties of thought, action, and emotion and often conceived as an immaterial entity.
The spiritual nature of humans, regarded as immortal, separable from the body at death, and susceptible to happiness or misery in a future state.
The disembodied spirit of a dead human.
A human: “the homes of some nine hundred souls” (Garrison Keillor).
The central or integral part; the vital core: “It saddens me that this network... may lose its soul, which is after all the quest for news” (Marvin Kalb).
A person considered as the perfect embodiment of an intangible quality; a personification: I am the very soul of discretion.
A person's emotional or moral nature: “An actor is... often a soul which wishes to reveal itself to the world but dare not” (Alec Guinness).
A sense of ethnic pride among Black people and especially African Americans, expressed in areas such as language, social customs, religion, and music.
A strong, deeply felt emotion conveyed by a speaker, a performer, or an artist.
Soul music.
\Soul\, n. [OE. soule, saule, AS. s[=a]wel, s[=a]wl; akin to OFries. s?le, OS. s?ola, D. ziel, G. seele, OHG. s?la, s?ula, Icel. s[=a]la, Sw. sj["a]l, Dan. si[ae]l, Goth. saiwala; of uncertain origin, perhaps akin to L. saeculum a lifetime, age (cf. Secular.)] 1. The spiritual, rational, and immortal part in man; that part of man which enables him to think, and which renders him a subject of moral government; -- sometimes, in distinction from the higher nature, or spirit, of man, the so-called animal soul, that is, the seat of life, the sensitive affections and phantasy, exclusive of the voluntary and rational powers; -- sometimes, in distinction from the mind, the moral and emotional part of man's nature, the seat of feeling, in distinction from intellect; -- sometimes, the intellect only; the understanding; the seat of knowledge, as distinguished from feeling. In a more general sense, an animating, separable, surviving entity, the vehicle of individual personal existence.'' --Tylor.
The eyes of our souls only then begin to see, when our bodily eyes are closing. --Law.
2. The seat of real life or vitality; the source of action; the animating or essential part. The hidden soul of harmony.'' --Milton.
Thou sun, of this great world both eye and soul. --Milton.
3. The leader; the inspirer; the moving spirit; the heart; as, the soul of an enterprise; an able general is the soul of his army.
He is the very soul of bounty! --Shak.
4. Energy; courage; spirit; fervor; affection, or any other noble manifestation of the heart or moral nature; inherent power or goodness.
That he wants algebra he must confess; But not a soul to give our arms success. --Young.
5. A human being; a person; -- a familiar appellation, usually with a qualifying epithet; as, poor soul.
As cold waters to a thirsty soul, so is good news from a far country. --Prov. xxv. 25.
God forbid so many simple souls Should perish by the aword! --Shak.
Now mistress Gilpin (careful soul). --Cowper.
6. A pure or disembodied spirit.
That to his only Son . . . every soul in heaven Shall bend the knee. --Milton.
Note: Soul is used in the formation of numerous compounds, most of which are of obvious signification; as, soul-betraying, soul-consuming, soul-destroying, soul-distracting, soul-enfeebling, soul-exalting, soul-felt, soul-harrowing, soul-piercing, soul-quickening, soul-reviving, soul-stirring, soul-subduing, soul-withering, etc.
Syn: Spirit; life; courage; fire; ardor.

Rollo the Ax~~~ To put a fine point on the idea... even Goreans go to the cities of dust once dead, right ???? Is this not a reference to moving to a different plain of existence or gorean after life ???? None of Us here can prove any position or belief...we can but except whatever point we wish to for ourselves... * going to Heaven, dead and gone end of story, or reborn into another .... WHO KNOWS ??????

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *hears the conversation, slips quietly to spread out the furs , listening.....*

Emerald Forest~~~ *the soul would stay with the slave galah as without a soul you would die and the next Master or Mistress would need the slave to have a soul so He or She could train her the way He or She would want the slave to be*

Phen~~~ I don't think so galah the love stays with the last Master but submission to the fullest is given to the new Master*smiles*

galah{RA}~~~ sorcha, it is indeed deep, and not meant to take all the forum time, just to get everyones brains working alil until another topic comes up heheheheheheheee heheheheheheee

sorcha{HoS}~~~ *winking at galah*...hmmmmm.....this ones brain is always working...she thinks that is her problem..she thinks too much..*lol*

Shadowglade~~~ *chuckle* oh, I don't know Rollo I could prove it...*chuckle* but what fun would that be??? *grinning as I step out of the shadows silently, and stride to the dais, sitting upon My chair*

galah{RA}~~~ geeeeeezzz, this one thinks jasma is all out of breath after that one? heheheheheheee

galah{RA}~~~ that was very very good jaz!!!! very informative

shirin{SholGar}~~~ ~*~sits quietly listening...giggles at galah~*~

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~winking at galah then panting~.. aye sis.. out of breath.. thanks.. *giggling*

Shadowglade~~~ *nodding and winking to those greeting Me, as I listen for more on this topic, or await the next....

Rollo the Ax~~~ Okay... I also believe that * souls * go on... from lifetime to lifetime.... I feel that I have lived before... past lives, past existences... not even all human...animals and such.... but be that as it may, I feel that YES, slaves MUST have a soul, and that is long as they draw breath, they OWN or have that soul... a Master may own the body, but they can't remove the soul and hold it in their hand, so the slave will have the soul....

galah{RA}~~~ when it is said that a slave owns nothing, does that only mean in a material sense of the word Master Rollo?

Phen~~~ *Looking over to the Captain who has just entered I lower My head in respect before thinking more on the subject matter*

sorcha{HoS}~~~ smiling as she hears Master Rollo's words

Phen~~~ galah look you girls own your thoughts don't you? So why not a soul?

Shadowglade~~~ I don't know galah...I think it transcends the material sense, but at the same time...questions of a soul in My opinion can never truly be answered in a way that will suit everyone...*shrugs* does a slave, or doesn't a slave...*shrugs* for that matter does an Assassin or doesn't He? *shrugs* it could be argued either way, and validly so I believe...

Rollo the Ax~~~ Yes galah, to *MY* way of thinking, or My opinion, the Gorean idea that * slaves own NOTHING * speaks ONLY about material things... cloths,food, money.... that kind of stuff... a slave " owns " her wit, her intelligence, her *soul*... but these all come as part and parcel with her body when sold.....

galah{RA}~~~ but where is the line drawn about a slave owning anything? she may indeed have thoughts, but a slave knows well when to express these thoughts and when not too heheheheheee heheheheheee same can be said for a sense of humor, a girl still must tread lightly with such, for if a free expresses unhappiness with it, she will well learn to keep quiet...how does one control her soul?

Phen~~~ galah I have to go with Rollo on one of His earlier points too just because a person has a collar dosent mean they dont have a soul, what about a freed slave don't tell Me there's a Merchant in each town and city selling souls back to them*smiling*...

galah{RA}~~~ and then the Master weeds out or feeds those qualities that he dislikes or likes Master Rollo?

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *nodding at the words of Master Rollo...smiling*

Mandi~~~ ::chuckles:: Nay, Phen I have seen no Merchants do that, but perhaps a Slave Trader could throw it in for a little extra.

dina{HoS}t~~~ lays her head on His strong thigh ... listening *~

Rollo the Ax~~~ LOL..LOL.. Like I have said time and time again, * Gorean * matters are open to SOOO many ways of looking at, or interpretation, that we may well NEVER get a concessus or agree on many points.... Hell, how long has the world had the Bible ?? the Koran ?? the Talmud ?? and not even all those that believe in them except the same rules or ideas.... What chance does a few people reading some Sci-Fi books have ????? LOL...LOL..

galah{RA}~~~ hehehehehee yes Master Rollo, and Master John Norman even contradicts himself many times over, just to keep us totally confused? heheheheheheheee

Shadowglade~~~ *stroking her hair gently as I listen silently*

shirin{SholGar}~~~ ~*~nods in total agreement with Master Rollo~*~


The books.. Intelligent slaves

galah{RA}~~~ perhaps we can stretch this out to cover more subject matter? intelligence is prized in a kajira, for no Master wants a dumb bell, so why are kajira not educated for reading and writing and such?

Mandi~~~ That would be a lot of work for jaz, galah.

Phen~~~ galah depends on what type of kajira you are talking about a captured one or bred one ....Look at the house of Bosk Luma was His Scribe both as a Free Woman and as His slave....

inara{G}t~~~ *sits on Masters lap listening.*

Gornt~~~ ~arms around her waist listening~

galah{RA}~~~ galah read one book she knows a slave kept the bookwork for Master, she was indeed a most intelligent slave and very valuable, but galah thinks most Masters do not find it necessary for his girls to know of such stuff?

Rollo the Ax~~~ They ARE galah.... in several of the books... if it pleases a Master he will have a girl taught how to read or write.... or to play a musial interment, or dance... so it was done in the books.....

Shadowglade~~~ that is because many Men on Gor have not learned the value of an intelligent slave....*shrugs* I think Many see a slave merely as a guaranteed cyber-lay, and don't stop to think how many other uses a girl can have...*chuckle* I personally will exploit every possible talent, or resource My slave possesses....

Phen~~~ I don't agree with you on that galah look at the damn is it the love wars, I'm still bit rusty from being away for so long, the Higher Caste of the Women the greater the prize....

inara{G}t~~~ *grins at Master Shadowglade*

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *listening to Master Rollo and Master Shadowglade, a girl smiles at Their words.......*

galah{RA}~~~ **claps softly at Master Shadowglades comment** a girl wishes more Masters thought as you do Master Shadowglade

Phen~~~ Also galah I think reading and writing as a general for all Goreans was not a neccesity unless One was of the Higher Castes as well as the Merchants...

Mandi~~~ ::chuckles:: But reading and writing are handy for online Goreans, Phen.

Cernus~~~ I am of the same accord as Shadowglade.........when a Master has a slave for a period of time and He sees the intellegentence in her...she becomes unsellable as well as a part of him

Shadowglade~~~ *LOL* Well, galah...*chuckle* I wish a FEW more thought as I did, but if EVERYONE thought as I did, then I wouldn't be all that special, now would I? *chuckle*

galah{RA}~~~ granted Mistress....reading and writing does not necessarily show intelligence...a girl may well be intelligent but still does not read or write, one may well read and write but has no common sense or real intelligence when it comes to solving a problem.

Rollo the Ax~~~ I don't agree with that concept, Phen... slaves were judged on beauty and brains... being high caste does NOT automatically mean brighter or smarter.... FW could wear robes to hide ugly as well as beauty.....LOL...LOL..

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *hearing Master Cernus' words....nuzzling Him happily*

Phen~~~ *Laughs at Mandi's comment*

Shadowglade~~~ well don't get Me wrong here Cernus, I don't believe ANY slave is unsellable....*chuckle* slaves are slaves after all...though We may really enjoy them, they are property, and I work hard at not allowing Myself the luxery of becoming over attached to My slaves.....why, just the other day, I sold one of Mine off...for a hand full of copper tarsks, though I valued her very much, it was time for her to move on...

galah{RA}~~~ oooohh yes Mistress Mandi, a non reading writing online slave would be purdy useless hehehehehehehehee hehehehehee

Cernus~~~ laughs at Shadowglade aye you be correct, however, I enjoy My aandra, it's just we have been together so long that she anticipates My needs,as well as my moves...lol

Phen~~~ Aye Rollo but then beauty is in the eye of the owner*Laughs* So I feel we could talk all day on these issues and as it has been stated still none would be any of the wiser*smiling* and some would still have their own views that no one could change*SS*

Gornt~~~ One is right Captain

Shadowglade~~~ *winking to aandra as I look to Cernus* I am glad You are pleased with your slave then...*chuckle*

Cernus~~~ aye ...chuckles

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *amber eyes looking up at Him.......a girl's cheeks bright with color....knowing His words to be so very true....aandra nuzzles in closer still*

aandra{Cernus}~~~ *eyes full of mischief....feels the gaze of Master Shadowglade upon a girl....lowers them immediately, smiling*


Tavern Tattler and GS Homepage updates

Rollo the Ax~~~ Okay folks, lets move on to another topic........ LOL.. anybody have one ????? LOL.... while waiting, jasma why not remind everybody about the Tattler and home page info or submissions ????

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~listening to Master Rollo.. voice soft~
thank You, Master..
a girl just wished to remind everyone if they have something for the Tavern Tattler to be placed in.. an article.. poetry.. jokes.. etc.. please send it to Tavern Tattler by the 25th of the month..
also.. for any that are working on bios for the GS homepage.. they can be emailed to jasma{GS~FG}

Mandi~~~ This is more administrative, but with the influx of new slaves and the changes of names and collars on several, an updated list of slaves on the homepage would be very helpful.

Phen~~~ *Winking to the FG* I know Bolt has a story jaz*SS*

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~listening to Mistress Mandi.. offering~
jaz was keeping a list of slaves listed on one of her pages, yet she hasn't had time to do anywork on her pages, due to other things she's involved in right now, but will update it as time allows her to do so.. one apologizes for the delay in getting it done..
~lowering liquid gems.. ~

shirin{SholGar}~~~ ~*~smiles to jaz, knowing she owes her something for the tattler this month, crossing fingers that rt behaves and allows her the time~*~

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~smiling to Mistress Phen.. ~ a girl looks forward to receiving His story, Mistress

Mandi~~~ thank you jaz. And a hearty "well done, girl" and the tremendous amount of scribe work you are getting done.

calia{GS}~~~ making mental note to tackle a willing slave,to help calia with this slaves position submission...~* smiling to jaz....

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~smiling back to sis shirin.. ~

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~softly~.. thank You, Mistress Mandi..
~winking to calia.. ~


Caste Codes

Rollo the Ax~~~ Okay, the next topic is from Shadowglade.... take it away, SG... and You run the forum from here on, I need to step away from My keyboard.... Be well, all... if I don't make it back.....

Shadowglade~~~ *rereading My Brothers words* Ok....Let's compare book Goreans to VT goreans for a moment...in the books, did Goreans hold true strictly to their caste codes, or did they "bend the rules" here and there, and if so, how then should We as VT Goreans adapt that to our roleplay?

inara{G}t~~~ *listens having never read the books*

Phen~~~ No disrespect Captain but what are the codes as in the books they are not all stated so how could we as VT Goreans interpret them as well as abide by them....

Mandi~~~ This may or may not be on point, Shadowglade, but on the specific issue of truthfulness, Goreans simply did not accept lying, yet sometimes would engage in using disguises and allowing Others to gather incorrect inferences, and would use deceit to advantage at times.

Cernus~~~ agrees with Mandi....i.e.the caste of spies,and assassins

Shadowglade~~~ Phen, I guess, just as We did when reading the books, We'd use Our imaginations...*shrugs* of course they're not all stated, but Im talking about the one's that WERE stated....

Phen~~~ OK the only ones I recall that are stated are some of the aphorisms of the Warrior code so is it only that Caste online that should abide by those codes?

Shadowglade~~~ well, they also stated specific customs of the Merchant's Caste, and a few of the Physician's caste too Phen...*shrugs* as well, as a few somewhat vague references to the Builder's caste, as well as the Initiates Caste..(though I've never met a VT Initiate chuckle)

Shadowglade~~~ so, I wonder, personally, how close to Caste customs, or in the case of the Caste of Warriors, the codes, should WE as VT Goreans follow? The Goreans in the books were not always strict about their customs, so, how strict, then, should WE be?....

Gornt~~~ it depends on how anal We want to be
One of things I think that sets GS apart is its liberality
We adhere to behaviors that bring Our Tavern honor but not make it stifling

Phen~~~ Yes customs and sentences like a Physician stating I heal that is My Caste...But here in Port Kar I dont think it can or would work. We have a Council of Captains not a Hifh Cancel of Caste so who can or would uphold Caste decisions? Also remember what Port Kar is made up of cut throats, murderers, pirates, she urts, a whole bunch of different people never seen elsewhere on Gor*smiles* Thank the PKs*laughs*

Mandi~~~ I have not run into that issue much, except with Strangers Who come in and want to spout off about this or that. One wanted to criticize a part of a serve because it did not follow "His idea" from the books that holding the vessel three heartbeats was in conjunction with tasting for poison.

Shadowglade~~~ but that's not always true Gornt...*shrugs* I've noticed that GS, as with most anyplace, changes depending on who's present...if there are "strict Goreans" present, the atmosphere becomes a bit more dangerous, or tense, and if there are alot of new people, or "liberal Goreans" present the atmosphere becomes almost celebratory...is there a happy medium between the two?

calia{GS}~~~ ~*biting into her lips as she hears Mistress Mandi's words..~* a lil shiver courses thru calia as she smiles to Her...

Gornt~~~ ~nodding~
I think there is Captain

Shadowglade~~~ *nodding to the Physician* That is true Phen, so, again, how are We to keep Our roleplay interesting, yet as close to the books as a majority would have it?

Phen~~~ *Smiles To the Captain* Yes there is I have seen it and felt it but that depends on the group of ppl and is Caste Codes going to bring that about?

Shadowglade~~~ *chuckle* I don't know Phen, I just thought it an interesting topic...*shrugs* I think that many who claim a caste on Gor seldom even know really what it is about...and "Earthenize" it to some degree, and then you have those that will do everything contrary to them because they wish to be "true" to the books....I would like to know if there is a majority idea about what the happy medium would consist of...

Phen~~~ *Shrugs* All I can say is respect Your character as well as the next persons and roleplay with things in the books this is where it gets difficult Captain....slaves have to learn but a Free well they don't and I feel this is where the main issues lie....

Mandi~~~ ~~smile lines appear above veils~~ Aye, Shadowglade, You have hit on something very significant there, perhaps the flux and clash of personalities and the search for the "happy medium" is what keeps Our Home interesting. It would be boring if these things were "settled" once and for all.

Emerald Forest~~~ *as You said before Shadowglade,I think it comes down to the part of Who is in the tavern and how They roleplay the part*


Subtopic: More roleplay.. More Gorean

galah{RA}~~~ galah personally would like to see GS be more of the harsh way of a Port Kar tavern, Masters pounding fist on tables, pulling passing slave girls into their laps or pinching a slaves bottom as they walk by....GS is much too prim and proper to be a Port Kar tavern full of warriors, thieves and whatever other kind of ruffians there are

galah{RA}~~~ think galah spoke alil of this last week....like a Master hollaring for a drink, pounding a fist...not waiting for some lil slavegirl to offer....galah would like to see the free roleplay more, some do but most free don't...a slave doesn't know where the free are or what they are doing, standing, sitting and how they sit etc...

inara{G}t~~~ *grins agreeing with galah*

Phen~~~ Oh please no galah as then I would never be allowed in or would have to become a she urt*laughing*

Gornt~~~ oh

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ ~listening quietly~

galah{RA}~~~ well, you know Free Women are allowed and would still have to remain prim and proper to be sure, but that sure don't mean that men have to be like that....a gorean master prim and proper? Men on gor should act like men on gor and not like men of earth hehehehehehehee

inara{G}t~~~ *grins at Master*

Shadowglade~~~ I agree with you both, Lady, galah....you both make good points...I personally would like to see a rowdy Tavern, but at the same time would like to see people respect their roles, and each others....*chuckle* and I think it could happen if We each keep in mind that every person has a perspective, and that theirs is not always the ONLY correct one...*chuckle* I feel We should be able to agree to disagree, but at the same time, hold nothing back....be who you are on Gor...and be it all the way...

Gornt~~~ one wants Me to bang on the table

Mandi~~~ ::chuckling at galah and looking at Phen:: There are no rowdy Free Women at GS.

galah{RA}~~~ say a Master grabs a girl and throws her into his lap...she gasp and tells the Master she is not allowed to do so by her Master....so the Master pushes her away, laughing and says for her to go on her way then....there is no disrespect to any that way? an honest mistake and it's some interesting and fun roleplay?

Phen~~~ *Smiling to the Captain as I stand*....Captain thank You for the discussion I wish I could stay longer and talk more with You on the matter but I can't...*Turning to galah*...I still have a problem with prim and proper Free Woman in Port Kar*laughs*....

Shadowglade~~~ Oh yes there are Mandi....She's just been away for a while...*winking at Phen*

inara{G}t~~~ *giggles* Well maybe not exactly Master, but if Master wished............*grins*

Shadowglade~~~ exactly galah...*nodding* exactly....

galah{RA}~~~ we can't have everyone up in arms because some Master pinched or swatted a slaves hiney....seems at times that some are just to touchy, having a slave restricted is one thing, but lets keep it real?

Kyoto~~~ Reading back over the posts

inara{G}t~~~ Though this one has not read the books, she would assume a tavern would not be so proper.............*Grins*

Phen~~~ *Laughing softly as I hear the Captains words*

Kyoto~~~ I think that even if a girl is white silk, she can be grabbed and groped for a few ihn... it happened in the books, the girls would just protest and be released.

Shadowglade~~~ For all you Trek lovers out there, I liken Goreans to Klingons....but all the women are human...*chuckle* imagine how the two would interract, and that's Gor to Me...

galah{RA}~~~ slaves must always show respect, frees should also show respect to the free, but the free of GS show wayyyyyy to much respect to the slaves most the time...slaves here are just that, slaves....treat them as such and it will make for a better time for all concerned....this one has pondered what has changed online gor over the years, and this problem is a big part of it

Shadowglade~~~ indeed, Kyoto...*nodding* groped, accosted, and released...but never abused...*chuckle* there's no such thing as "sexual harrassment" on Gor....nor should that mindset even be allowed to exist here...

inara{G}t~~~ *giggles at that image*

shirin{SholGar}~~~ mmmmmm ~*~purrs loving galah's thoughts, remembering the *one* time shirin's bottom was pinched, soooo long ago, gigglin~*~

calia{GS}~~~ ...~* lil purrr streams from calias lips..~*
knowing even this redsilk would love a lil grabbing and groping *winking at Master Kyoto*~* ...all in fun and tavern atmosphere ....- lil heated,lil raunchy....*giggling* , for paga sluts were the hottest around....~smiling to those of common bond*

galah{RA}~~~ there's just NO fear anymore....since Master Kli left, no one slave rapes heheheheheheheee none here make a slave crawl on her belly or swabs up his spilt paga with her hair

Kyoto~~~ Define "abused", SG, I want to know how much I can get away with.

galah{RA}~~~ do most here even know that slaves hair was used for such things?

calia{GS}~~~ .... and the fear, the nervousness....the uneasy and groveling..is what makes a slaves belly ...BURN with intensity... .....~* .....

Kyoto~~~ No one, galah?
You must have missed the last couple of times I've been in here.

calia{GS}~~~ washing the floor....dusting off boots.....~* ...

inara{G}t~~~ *grins listening to galah, nodding*

galah{RA}~~~ it all started when all the slaves was so well trained that none required punishment, but from there it became so common for these perfect lil slaves to be treated like princesses....not a good thing!!!!

Kyoto~~~ Slave hair was used to clean weapons, to silence the slave for sex or branding... whatever the Master thought he needed to use it for.

Shadowglade~~~ *chuckle* Kyoto, I define abused as anything I would not want One to do to My slave...so when considering it, think of penny, and ask yourself, how would YOU feel if One did it to her?

Kyoto~~~ Well, she's red silk... I'm cool as long as I don't have to watch.

shirin{SholGar}~~~ ~raises her hand~ ooo ooo ooo, shirin knows galah, just read that in Kajira today, hehehehehehe

Shadowglade~~~ *chuckle* Well, Kyoto, as long as no one forces My girls to break their restrictions, I will have no quarrel with anyone..*chuckle* My slaves are slaves, and that is what I require of them....to be slaves..

Shadowglade~~~ Well folks, it's time for the forum to close, please feel free to stay and chat, but slaves, you will be expected to serve....*slapping the table hard to get dina's attention* I call this forum to a close...officially...for those slaves leaving, you have 3 minutes in which to do it before you must beg...

jasma{GS~FG}~~~ a girl is thankful for being permitted to be here to learn..

galah{RA}~~~ **now having stirred up the pot real good, she dashes for the door** heheheheheheeee wishing all well!!!!!

Shadowglade~~~ *winking at jas*(

calia{GS}~~~ thank You Master Shadowglade,for allowing this slave to learn and speak openly....